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scrivener
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Post subject: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chassis Posted: Jan Mon 16, 2012 7:00 pm |
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Joined: Jun Fri 05, 2009 4:20 pm Posts: 135 Location: Eastern PA
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Thought a flyback went bad when set shorted out several years ago due to being stored in damp area. Small amount of wax dripped out as set shorted out, but no visible residue/burning. All tubes light, including picture tube -- except for 2AV2 video rectifier tube on HV cage. I get power surge sound when set is turned on, audio hum, and channel selector light working, but no video or audio.
Before I replace flyback, want to see if simple fuse or resistor or tubes could be culprit. Don't want to assume the worst, even though flyback failure seems a logical diagnosis.
Can anyone direct me to the physical location of fuses and likely resistors that might be responsible? Don't have schematic handy, not a tekkie, so I need to locate physical location on chassis. Thanks. Also, anyone know a TV tech in the Philadelphia/Trenton area who works on tube sets and might be able to honestly diagnose and repair at reasonable price? I realize I might be dealing with voltage issues that need adjustments I cannot make on my own. Thank you.
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Bill Cahill
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Mon 16, 2012 8:15 pm |
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Joined: Apr Fri 21, 2006 12:49 am Posts: 9173
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Hi. First, that tube, which is the focus rectifier, you would not normally see it lighting. Though there is hv there, the filament itself operates off a very low voltage off a winding on the flyback.
First, have you tested any tubes? Damper, horizontal output, regulator,hv rect. , focus rectifier could all cause this problem. So could any number of other circuit problems. If the flyback goes bad, they generally go in a big way, including smoke, and, often a fire. I'm not yet convinced that's your problem. Some of the later RCA sets used a fusable wire, but, not a fuse per say. Circuit breakers would be in low voltage power supply. You may have other issues, such as an open, or, shorted electrolytic in low voltage power supply. Where did wax drip from?? Where in the set did you locate it? The flybacks on the later sets generally had better insulation than wax.. Often with a plastic, non removable sleeve around the hv donut winding. Did you plug set in shortly after getting it out of dampness? That's a very bad idea for any part of the set. Bill Cahill
_________________ http://www.tuberadioforum.com/ PLEASE visit Tube Radio Forums-The best forum in the World!
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scrivener
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Mon 16, 2012 9:14 pm |
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Joined: Jun Fri 05, 2009 4:20 pm Posts: 135 Location: Eastern PA
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Thanks, Bill. Immediately after the set shorted out, I smelled that burning electrical smell and saw a small amount of goo leaking from under the console. This was several years ago, and as I recall it was yellowish. It was a small amount, and as I recall it was found under or near the HV cage. But when I closely inspected the set yesterday, there's not a trace of leakage on the screen that covers the bottom of the set -- BUT the small coil transformer near but to the left of the HV cage (looking from the back, coated in yellow wax, looked like the paper coating was slightly torn, so maybe that's where the goo came from. Even so, there's no sign of a massive meltdown, and none of the electronics looks burned on even singed. To answer your question about when I turned the set back on the other day, it was after I moved it inside from the garage and let it sit in a well-heated room four about 4-5 hours.
And no, I did not test any tubes because I can't find anyone close with a tube-tester. I have used a radio guy about an hour south of me so I'll take the tubes to him and get them checked and hopefully he's got some video tubes on hand. Your post has me thinking that I gave up on this set too soon. It's one of those danish consoles and the case looks great, like a piece out of "Mad Men" or that RCA in the movie "Appollo 13" where the wife is watching the coverage. But the garage storage gave it a pretty significant cataract, which I will deal with if and when I can get the set working. Thanks again, any further suggestions would be appreciated. I'm pretty good on restoring RCA Victor 45 players, know nothing much about TV repair...
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Bill Cahill
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Tue 17, 2012 12:04 am |
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Joined: Apr Fri 21, 2006 12:49 am Posts: 9173
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First, I'd reccommend you get the schematic for this set. Sounds like that small transformer may be dammaged. The set likely needs new electrolytics at this stage. You should have let it dry for more like two weeks. Takes awhile for dampness to dry. Set is probably worth fixing. You might wish to get, or, borrow a good picture tube tester, and, test the three guns to make sure it's good before you put alot into this set. You need to take it slowly. TV's have considerably higher voltages than 45 players. We can help you. Bill Cahill
_________________ http://www.tuberadioforum.com/ PLEASE visit Tube Radio Forums-The best forum in the World!
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Eric H
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Tue 17, 2012 1:53 am |
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am Posts: 5662 Location: Redlands CA
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No Video and Hum in Audio would be more likely a B+ problem than a bad Flyback, the fact the the degausser hits when you turn it on tells me the Breaker or Fuse is OK.
I would look for a bad filter capacitor or a bad rectifier, Diode or Selenium or whatever is used. Possibly a resistor feeding B+ has opened up.
The Flyback will be hard to find so you don't want to replace it until your certain it's bad, a little wax dripping out is normal on these old beasts.
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scrivener
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Tue 17, 2012 2:31 am |
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Joined: Jun Fri 05, 2009 4:20 pm Posts: 135 Location: Eastern PA
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Thanks, Bill and Eric H. That degausser surge at turn-on and the hum gives me hope. Now that I think about it, the small amount of goo that dripped from the set was black, not yellow, and it was a very small amount, doesn't even show now. It would be good news if it was just an open resistor that melted due to moisture (set was on and working when it went out in about 2000 or 2001). Would something that simple knock out video and audio? I am going to pull the chassis out for a more thorough inspection (I looked at the underside with the set on its side). I will let the set sit for another couple of weeks. Want to try all the simple solutions first, like a better visual inspection, testing tubes, re-cap. One final question: other than selling this to a prop house for use in TV and movies, do these Danish console RCA mid-60s sets have any appeal to collectors? Website of Bill Foster Vintage TV up in N. Jersey says these models could be worth up to $250 . Dad paid about $550 for this set in 1966, a small fortune back then. The cabinet looks new and has only minor scratches. When I rubbed in some light varnish on the top, it really came up shockingly nice. A real memory jolt when I walk in the room. That's another reason I will probably keep it -- as a talisman. Thanks.
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Electronic Memory
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Tue 17, 2012 4:46 am |
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Joined: Nov Thu 11, 2010 6:03 pm Posts: 397 Location: Pewaukee, WI
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I agree on B+ issues being likely. Also if it is a capacitor related B+ issue one of the lytics could have blown it's seal and leaked out it's electrolite (or whatever the correct term for that paste is) and that could have been what you observed leaking.
Tom C.
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scrivener
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Tue 17, 2012 5:44 am |
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Joined: Jun Fri 05, 2009 4:20 pm Posts: 135 Location: Eastern PA
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Thanks, Tom. Hope you're right, that a re-cap and lytic update will fix it. Then it's onto cataract removal.
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scrivener
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Thu 19, 2012 8:32 am |
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Joined: Jun Fri 05, 2009 4:20 pm Posts: 135 Location: Eastern PA
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Looked inside HV cage, found a gob of melted wax on the horizontal part directly below the doughnut with a singed brown area. So maybe that's the problem. When I put the cage cap back on, I turned the set on. I still get audio/no video, but now I am not hearing a noticeable degausser sound as I was before I peeked into the HV cage. Don't know why. Everything else is status quo. All tubes light, get warm EXCEPT for the 2AV2 focus rectifier tube on the side of the HV cage. That one stays cold, which tells me the flyback is probably shot, unless there's a loose connection that I am not seeing, or that tube is bad. I will look again and also try to find another focus rectifier tube that checks out. If any club members in the Philadelphia-Trenton area can help me out, I would invest in a replacement flyback. If it needs a lot of tubes and a total re-cap, then I'll probably sell it. My email is [url]scrivener50@verizon.net[/url] The chassis number is 24A, the model number is GH-654. I found this original newspaper ad for the set, which still looks nearly new: http://www.fultonhistory.com/Process%20small/Newspapers/Valley%20News/Oswego%20Valley%20News%201967%20%20pdf/Newspaper%20Oswego%20Valley%20News%201967%20-%200338.pdf
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scrivener
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Thu 19, 2012 8:39 am |
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Joined: Jun Fri 05, 2009 4:20 pm Posts: 135 Location: Eastern PA
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P.S. I got a notice that another post was made to this thread, but the last one I see is the Jan. 17 post from Tom C. and my thank you to him. Am I not seeing the new post?
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Bruce McGee
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Sun 22, 2012 12:37 am |
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am Posts: 322 Location: Asheville, NC USA
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I tend to doubt that the 2AV2 is bad. You dont have high voltage... you'd hear it come up if you did. Theres plenty of other things that might cause sound/no picture.
Have you access to a tube tester? You might need to test what you have first.
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wiscojim
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Sun 22, 2012 2:08 am |
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Joined: Sep Fri 07, 2007 2:27 am Posts: 2659 Location: Appleton, Wisconsin
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scrivener wrote: P.S. I got a notice that another post was made to this thread, but the last one I see is the Jan. 17 post from Tom C. and my thank you to him. Am I not seeing the new post? The ARF email notices have been working marginally for the last week or so. The email notifications are delayed by a couple of days. viewtopic.php?f=2&t=183900.
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scrivener
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Post subject: Re: Fuse, circuit breaker location on RCA Victor CTC24 chass Posted: Jan Sun 22, 2012 10:06 pm |
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Joined: Jun Fri 05, 2009 4:20 pm Posts: 135 Location: Eastern PA
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