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 Post subject: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Thu 01, 2018 9:48 pm 
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Joined: Jan Fri 05, 2018 1:36 am
Posts: 7
Location: Oregon
Looking for a service manual to Hickok 580A. Trying to calibrate/troubleshoot one I purchased. The operator manual has only a few adjustments which I have performed. The#81 bulb is on dimly when the Line Set is set at center.

I have been in contact with Roger Kennedy but as a backup thought I would try this forum.

Thanks,
Craig Bateman


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 4:09 am 
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Joined: Aug Mon 04, 2014 9:42 pm
Posts: 47
The line fuse lamp should come on dimly when line set is adjusted correctly - this is normal; more than dimly is a problem. I've got one, but I haven't worked with it much


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 5:36 am 
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Joined: Jan Fri 05, 2018 1:36 am
Posts: 7
Location: Oregon
I have seen that posted on this forum but this is the only Hickok that I know that would be normal. As current increases to a certain level it should come on. Have you verified GM? The operators manual is really lacking on alignment. No plate or screen procedure.

If there was more of a procedure for alignment I could maybe isolate the area that is drawing the current.

I have a 539B and a TV-7D. Their alignment procedure is thorough, although ranges are interrelated.

Thanks for your input.
Craig B.


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 7:12 am 
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Joined: Aug Wed 31, 2011 11:23 pm
Posts: 430
Location: Tucson, AZ
There is no service manual/alignment procedure for the 580A. There are just a few adjustments noted in the standard manual. The diodes in these tube testers literally fall apart and need to be replaced, along with the electrolytic capacitors.

The 580A draws a bit more current because of the three transformers, they also can develop some leakage over time resulting in more current draw so the fuse light is lit with no tube inserted. There are a few other issues with the Hickok 580 and 580A, so their test readings are really not comparable to other tube testers. They also have an issue with plate transformer winding imbalance for the different plate voltages, to get accurate readings requires zeroing the meter at each plate voltage level. This requires other mods.


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 1:09 pm 
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Joined: Nov Wed 30, 2016 7:35 pm
Posts: 800
Location: OHIO 43074
I would not worry too much about a dimly lit lamp. It's indicating total current drawn by the entire tester, and also serves as a fuse of sorts. If your test results are correct, the minor glowing should not be an issue. I have two 580's waiting for me to "get around to them". What I liked about them were the three separate power transformers, but since there is really no alignment procedure as such, I decided to table the project for a time when I have more time.

Is your lamp an original exact part, or one of the newer replacements? The newer ones are most likely not exactly compatible with the originals, so that's a possible source of dimly lit bulbs as well.

Is the tester working? As noted, diodes and caps should be replaced as a matter of routine. You can easily check the other components individually as well ... diodes, resistors. As with all of these 50 year old instruments, good and PROPER cleaning of all switches is also a good place to start.

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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 4:07 pm 
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Joined: Jan Fri 05, 2018 1:36 am
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Location: Oregon
Looking at the features of the 580A I thought this is a perfect tester and should be highly accurate IF working correctly. No tube diodes to worry about. Plus dual triode tubes would be easier.

To answer the lamp, this came with 3 Sylvania 81 lamps. I am on the last one. The lamp base had some issues plus one burned out when I turned power on using my variac switch and having the voltage set on the "set line". Apparently you need to use the 580 power switch and bring the voltage up, have not had that issue again using it. The original power switch/rheostat was replaced with a variac transformer part number VT-350, rated 120 VAC 1.25 amp. I appears to work fine.

I checked all electrolytic caps and replaced all but one, it was within 10% tolerance. Tested all diodes with a curve tracer, they appeared OK. I have used contact cleaner and air on all switches and tube sockets. Not saying that these switches are clean enough, this tester sit for 20+ years in NYC.

Started alignment by the operator manual procedure. Bias voltage adjustment will only go to 48 volts. I replaced diodes CR12&13 even though they tested good on the curve tracer (they looked original but not sure). Still 48 volts. Screen voltage is also developed from this transformer. I set the tester up to test a 6L6 tube, screen voltage is about 200 volts, plate is 208 volts.

I decided at this point to pack it up and send to Roger Kennedy. He has helped me on a Hickok 6000 I owned and repaired the meter on the 539A. But he indicated that he can no longer work these with no parts available. SO back to working it myself. There is 4 more diodes that look original that test OK with the curve tracer. That is where I am going next.

Hickok had to perform calibration of all the other potentiometers and so there is documentation somewhere. That documentation would really help. If I get anything I will post.

Craig


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 6:12 pm 
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Joined: Nov Wed 30, 2016 7:35 pm
Posts: 800
Location: OHIO 43074
I might be able to help you out in a week or so, but not with documentation. There simply doesn't seem to be any regarding calibration. I did re-draw parts of the schematic and will try and get them posted eventually. I haven't checked them for errors yet.

I've got two of these, and maybe we can compare readings. But I'm in the final stages of a huge project that won't be done until next Tuesday, then I get back to my toys

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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 6:13 pm 
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Joined: Nov Wed 30, 2016 7:35 pm
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Location: OHIO 43074
BTW .... there is a general feeling that somewhere, out in a nameless desert, in a nameless vault, ALL of the Hickok factory secrets are waiting to be discovered and posted on Ebay ................... :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 7:14 pm 
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Joined: Dec Tue 01, 2015 5:31 am
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Location: Columbus Ohio
found the 580a manual on BAMA, http://bama.edebris.com/download/hickok ... 20580A.pdf
Page 26 starts the calibration procedures

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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 7:52 pm 
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Joined: Jan Fri 05, 2018 1:36 am
Posts: 7
Location: Oregon
Guess I should have mentioned I have an original paper operator manual which has the short calibration procedure and the Bama one too.

Barry thanks. This is a hobby to me. We have bad weather and work is not backing up on me so spending some time in my electronic shop. I have repaired/calibrated Hickoks 6000, 539B of which there is lengthy article written by Michael Higgins, plus a TV-7D. The TV-7 military manuals have lots of data but it does not pertain to the 580 series so much.

Once I get the bias voltage to 50 volts I can continue testing.

Thanks everyone.
Craig


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Fri 02, 2018 9:29 pm 
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Barry H Bennett wrote:
BTW .... there is a general feeling that somewhere, out in a nameless desert, in a nameless vault, ALL of the Hickok factory secrets are waiting to be discovered and posted on Ebay ................... :lol:


I just uploaded the Hickok 121 cardmatic manual to BAMA
they have an upload ftp site, where it looks like files may sit a while until they are cataloged.
ftp://bama.edebris.com/uploads/

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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Sat 03, 2018 1:08 am 
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Joined: Jan Fri 05, 2018 1:36 am
Posts: 7
Location: Oregon
After looking the circuit over and reading the operators manual I started looking at this another way.
First check meter accuracy. So meter resistance is 1500 (1503 actual) and full scale is 120 micro-amps. Voltage drop full scale across the meter would be 180 Millivolts (E=IXR) or .000120 X 1500. The easiest check would be to use the 0-50 Volt Bias volt calibration test and verify at different meter deflections. So I checked at 10, 20, 25 (midscale and Line Set point), 30, 40, and 45 I can only get to 48 volts bias so I stopped there. 180 divided by 5 is 36 millivolt drop at the 580A 10 volt indication so that was my starting point. My 580A meter is a little sticky so slight taps are required when testing. Both meters are digital Flukes and pretty accurate.

Meter 1 Voltage drop at 580A meter
Meter 2 Bias voltage on octal socket 1&2
Bias Dial indication
580A meter reading

My results below were:
Meter 1 Meter 2 Dail 580A Meter
.036 10.15 10.5 10
.072 20.3 21.0 20
.090 25.5 26 25
.108 30.5 32 30
.144 40.6 42.5 40
.162 45.7 47 44.8

The 580A meter at 48.3 volts bias (my maximum bias voltage) reads 47. But still good for a analog meter that is old.

So this tester may be OK. I will perform filament plate and screen voltages.

Thanks all and I will still work on this,
Craig


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Sat 03, 2018 1:13 am 
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Joined: Jan Fri 05, 2018 1:36 am
Posts: 7
Location: Oregon
My results below were:
Meter 1 Meter 2 Dail 580A Meter
.036 10.15 10.5 10
.072 20.3 21.0 20
.090 25.5 26 25
.108 30.5 32 30
.144 40.6 42.5 40
.162 45.7 47 44.8

When I posted these values the formatting went bad so this may help.
Craig


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Sat 03, 2018 9:51 am 
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Joined: Nov Wed 30, 2016 7:35 pm
Posts: 800
Location: OHIO 43074
Meter linearity is important if you want the best accuracy that any given tube tester will provide. You mentioned the meter sticking .... that will drive you nuts trying to calibrate the tester, and will always be suspect in tube test results. I'd fix that first. Possibly just static .... try wiping the meter face with a damp rag and leave it damp during your linearity test. If it's not static causing the sticking, fix what is causing it. A lot of the time it's traceable to dirt or junk in the magnetic gap of some meter movements which can be cleaned... if it's needle bearings or the needle itself or some other mechanical defect, you'll need watchmaker type skills to fix it. Lots of threads on this forum and elsewhere on meter movement repair.

Or, you could find a suitable meter replacement. Lots of threads on here about that as well, where you keep the original meter face, or print a new one.

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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Sat 03, 2018 4:18 pm 
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Joined: May Sat 14, 2016 12:37 pm
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Location: Princegreorge's MD U.S.A
I am also restoring a 580a that a golden screwdriver worked on and will follow along so we can figure those other adjustments out for future reference.

George.


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Sat 03, 2018 4:51 pm 
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Joined: Nov Wed 30, 2016 7:35 pm
Posts: 800
Location: OHIO 43074
I will try and get my revised (simpler to follow) schematics posted this evening. Hickok seems to have hired draftsmen that liked puzzles. I do know that there were changes made along the way, as with all equipment of this era. My two 580's have at the very least quite different circuitry in the gas test section ... one has 3 transistors, one has two. Haven't fully documented the differences yet

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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Sat 03, 2018 6:12 pm 
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Joined: Jan Fri 05, 2018 1:36 am
Posts: 7
Location: Oregon
I am not so good at meters,

Tried to repair the main one on my Hickok 539B. Cost me $300.00 for Roger Kennedy to rebuild it. But it's now is really smooth and linear.


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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Sun 04, 2018 1:47 am 
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Joined: Nov Wed 30, 2016 7:35 pm
Posts: 800
Location: OHIO 43074
Well, the PDF I wanted to post here of the 580 schematic is too big by about 50kb, so I will have to split it up and post it. I won't be able to get to this for a few weeks yet. If anyone wants the schematic I drew, please PM me and I'll Email you a copy. NOTE it is not for resale .. anyone may use it or copy it but no commercial usage is the intent of my efforts. It's free for all. I'll be posting this, and others, on my website once I get it done later this summer. Next up will be the 539B.

Barry

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 Post subject: Re: Hickok 580A Service Manual
PostPosted: Mar Sun 04, 2018 1:54 am 
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Joined: Dec Tue 01, 2015 5:31 am
Posts: 1179
Location: Columbus Ohio
get dropbox, works like a cloud folder and you can have public and private folders, etc. send links
http://dropbox.com

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