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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Feb Sun 18, 2007 8:09 am 
Christina:

As Alan Douglas mentioned (above), some radios in the late 1920's ~ early 1930's
had back panels but many did not. I am only aware of one Steinite console set with
a partial back-panel; the big model 102 Radio-Phono.

If you have any problem printing the schematic from Nostalgiaire, I'm sure one of the
members will be happy to do so for you, or, in a couple of days when I have either
fixed or replaced my computer, I will be happy to do so.

Terry:
Quote:
I was given a Steinite years ago. It was in a thick wood coffin cabinet. Hole
was cut for the window dial. but trim not installed. No speaker of course, but the
guts fit the smallish cabinet...Kinda.
<edit> The chassis is small and compact compared to Christina's.
It has a thumbwheel dial knob beside the window.


The only Steinite model I'm aware of that fits your description is the "260" series
(261, 262, 263, etc.) It sounds as if you are describing the model "261," they look
very much like a shorter Radiola 18. Good radios, though the power supply is
often inoperative when they are found it seems. If you can post a picture, it might help
confirm my conjecture. Like the Radiola 18, your Steinite was designed to operate
into the high impedence speaker of your choice. The Radiola 100/100A, the cute
little Peerless Cathedral style speakers, and others will work well with your Steinite 261.
(if that's what your set turns out to be)

Christina:

Referring back to my earlier post and your request for pictures of my 1931 Steinite model
421
after restoration - - - I'm still without my computer-scanner-camera, etc.
but I did find stored in this old Packard Bell another picture of the set as it was when
I agreed to purchase it. As it turned out, the cabinet was just sort of propped-together
for the photo. Not a problem really since I knew it was to be a full restoration. I wasn't
disappointed in the set or the seller, but I admit that my initial assessment of the
pile of parts was a little dismaying. Still, all-in-all, this is a hard to find Steinite model
and I was tickled to get it. (Yes, I did get the escutcheon with the set)
Image

Dale
Image
Hertzsogood>@<aol.com
(Remember Ya gotta get the red out)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Feb Sun 18, 2007 8:13 pm 
New Member

Joined: Feb Mon 12, 2007 4:33 am
Posts: 11
Dale, even loosely propped up, your radio certainly looks worth restoring. Is that flame mahogany veneer either side of the cabinet face? In restoring vintage/antique furniture, I have always balked at anything that might need veneer replacement, but an old radio cabinet with flat surfaces would be a great piece to learn on.

Gary (Rabbit) has graciously offered to scan the schematic diagram from his Rider manual. The Nostalgiaair.org site's diagram is illegible in some of the handwritten portions no matter how much you zoom in.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Feb Sun 18, 2007 9:15 pm 
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Joined: Feb Mon 12, 2007 4:33 am
Posts: 11
Alan Douglas wrote:
Radios were commonlyshipped and priced without tubes, which would have been added by the local dealer.

Many did not have backs.

I would be very surprised if the cabinet were made of solid lumber, since that is not dimensionally stable. The finish is almost certainly nitrocellulose lacquer. Depending on the maker, this can remain in nearly perfect condition for 70 years but most likely your set faced a sunny window all its life. The one side could be refinished by itself, any time in the future, as long as no silicone-containing polishes are used on it. I have a 1928 Steinite with an oval label inside proclaiming that it was finished in Duco lacquer. This must have been a sales point at the time, when lacquer was the latest thing.


Alan, "Duco" lacquer seems to have been used originally in the auto industry. Apparently a car could be assembled in days but the painting, done by hand, took two weeks to dry in elaborately configured conditions. "Duco" dried faster. I did find an old ad listed on E-Bay for a piano maker who boasted a "Duco" finish.

Even the shiny portions of my radio feel consistent with a finish that took a while to dry and attracted "stuff" floating in the air. Duco may have dried faster, but probably nothing like the products of today.

The damage to the "Duco" finish on my radio is worst around the decorative bullets on the lower front of the cabinet. It is truly ugly but only involves the finish, not the underlying wood. Here's a photo of it. Below that is a photo showing a close up view of a portion that I believe proves the wood on the front is (thick)veneer:

Image

Image
[/img]


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Feb Sun 18, 2007 11:22 pm 
Member

Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 27053
Location: Pocasset, Cape Cod, MA
Flowing out what's left, with lacquer thinner, then spraying with lacquer, might not look too bad. Depends on whether the bare wood has weathered, I suppose.

Here's a 1928 Steinite cabinet with no finish:

Image

I bought this from a local antique shoppe years ago, paid too much but didn't want to insult the owner as I thought I might buy more things from him later. It probably held a 991 or 261. Someone covered it with cloth and used it for a storage box. I've never found a use for it.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Feb Mon 19, 2007 2:15 am 
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Joined: Feb Mon 12, 2007 4:33 am
Posts: 11
[quote="Alan Douglas"]Flowing out what's left, with lacquer thinner, then spraying with lacquer, might not look too bad. Depends on whether the bare wood has weathered, I suppose.

That's a good idea to try after I've removed the radio and speaker and can lay the cabinet flat on its back. I really don't want to start stripping the finish off if at all possible. The legs in the front look similarly cruddy. I'm wondering if this radio was kept too close to a floor furnace at one time.

The colors on your antique radio box are so vibrant! I think I'd disassemble the box and hang just the part your picture shows on the wall in a more rustic room. In your picture it already looks framed!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Feb Mon 19, 2007 2:56 am 
Member

Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 27053
Location: Pocasset, Cape Cod, MA
Hmmm, not a bad idea. No wall space though. I'll bet the other side of the box looks the same.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Sun 18, 2007 5:46 am 
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Joined: Feb Mon 12, 2007 4:33 am
Posts: 11
Hi everyone!

I'm sad to say my father after a few weeks more chemo-radiation treatments and more to go yet decided he wasn't up to the task of restoring the Steinite.

The restoration is continuing, however, and it's very exciting. I have found someone near me who is experienced in restoring old radios and he has the radio out of the cabinet and with him now. The earliest radios he has restored have been from the 1930s, however.

You might find it interesting that the "cone" of the speaker is perfect, no rips, nothing to repair. It was removed and is sitting carefully protected by bubble wrap in a box.

Two tubes tested bad and need replacing. There is a tiny light bulb for the dial, too, which is on the schematic but could only be seen with the chassis removed. The celluloid strip for the dial appears intact.

He is replacing the capacitors and will be sending me photos of the work in progress. He has commented that the capacitors on the radio are HUGE, like "bricks" he said.

He thought it was interesting that there was a fuse in the chassis for the speaker and that it appeared one had a "choice of voltages."

He's asked me to inquire as to whether anyone has a "dial restring chart" that will work for this radio as "the cord slipped off and needs to be restrung," he says. I'd be so grateful if anyone here can help. Again, the radio is a 1929 Steinite Model 40A.

Now that progress is being made, I'll certainly be posting again.

Thanks in advance.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Sun 18, 2007 7:40 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 1209
Location: Making For Arcady
For the sake of historical integrity, please save the parts (tubes and condensers) that have been replaced, and keep them associated with the set. I don’t know how the two “bad” tubes were tested, but it is often the case that tubes that test “bad” will never the less work in a radio, especially one of this design (TRF—tuned radio frequency). All of the leaky condensers (capacitors) in this set are of the paper dielectric type. In some parts of the circuit, the leakage (electrical leakage current, not leakage of a liquid) will not appreciably affect the performance of the set. But if a set is to be put to regular use, by non-technical owners, then it is wise to replace all of the paper condensers. The originals, especially if they are box types mounted on the chassis, can be left in place, disconnected (an ideal way to preserve history). There will be space for the replacement condensers, which are much smaller.

I do not know of any source for a dial string drawing. The string route is likely very simple on this set, and with the existing string available to provide the information of its length, an experienced restorer should have no difficulty re-stringing the tuning mechanism. If this proves to be a problem, a clear photograph of the area in question could be posted here so that suggestions can be made.

Many thanks for keeping us up to date on the progress of the work on the radio. I think that your father will be able to enjoy using the radio once the repairs have been completed. When he is feeling better and stronger in future, you can find another radio to restore. :o


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Sun 18, 2007 10:57 am 
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Joined: Feb Mon 12, 2007 4:33 am
Posts: 11
Thanks for your suggestions, Phillip. I am forwarding your information to the man restoring the radio and will encourage him to register and post any questions he has here in this discussion board.

I took a couple of photos of the speaker and put it back safely in the box. Assuming it's original, the speaker is dusty but in great shape for almost 80 years old:

Image

Image


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Sun 18, 2007 6:41 pm 
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Joined: Feb Mon 12, 2007 4:33 am
Posts: 11
Regarding the speaker, is there something missing in the center? Searching posts on the forums I came across one that said some speakers had something there, some did not.

Regarding the dust, could I take a blow dryer on cold to get rid of gross dust and then a small soft brush on tighter spaces?

On the cabinet, which is much, much lighter without the radio, there are areas on the decorative skirt area and front legs that are pretty much shot and the wood must be sealed to protect it. Rather than stripping, in the bad areas I thought I'd take some 100 grade sandpaper to remove loose remnants of the old Duco finish and smooth out the surface. Since the Duco is lacquer based, I thought I'd try at least a couple of coats of high gloss Deft, also is lacquer based.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Sun 18, 2007 7:01 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 4838
Location: Baltimore, MD
Don't use a blow dryer on the speaker due to the heat. It can warp the cone. Get a can of compressed air from an office supply store and blow out the dust gently. Use a vacuum to get the remaining dirt out with, but be careful not to tear the paper speaker cone.

The center of the speaker looks all right to me. If there was anything there it was only a cover, but a lot of models didn't have them.

_________________
Tom

PM me for my email address


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Mon 19, 2007 12:23 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 13246
Location: Tennessee,USA
Hi,
Newer speakers had a felt in the center to prevent dirt froom going into the space around the center. Older sets did not have a felt.

The way I remove the crud from the speaker centers is like this.
Face the speaker down on a clean surface. Slightly tap the back of the speaker assemble enough to dislodge dirt from the center.
You could put a cloth on the back of the speaker, then use a small hamme to LIGHTLY tap the back so the dirt falls down on the surface.

Then you can try to gently move the cone in and out, just enough to move it, tap again, more dirt might come out.

Then use the compressed air as mentioned above. Tp protect the cone, cut a round piece of cardboard for the front, then secure it to the speaker frame, Youknow that speaker cones have an attraction to tools like a screwdriver falling on them :)

I have an email for you in a few minutes so take a look.
Take care,
Gary.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Mon 19, 2007 6:44 am 
Gary, I'll try your suggestion. I tried blowing some of the dirt out, which prompted a sneezing jag and didn't begin to touch dust that has infiltrated down into what appears to be felt as well as in back of the cone.

One of the work in progress photos below I have sent to you, the other is of the radio's "dual capacitors."

Image

Image


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Tue 20, 2007 8:24 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 13246
Location: Tennessee,USA
Hi,
I am not sure how the double cap was mounted, but it could easily hold the 2 new caps inside. That would maintain its original look.

But if you are not going that routem make sure you save these old parts in case you or someone else wantd to restuff this and reinstall it.

Will talk to you later.
Gary. :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Wed 21, 2007 2:55 am 
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Posts: 6815
Location: Warren, MI, USA 48093-6744 N42.50973 W83.02633
Christina, to easily explain the speaker, there is a part called a spider that keeps the cone centered. In the older speakers it was in the middle of the voice coil, and it was subject to dust.

A later development was to use a donut shape spider attached to the outside of the voice coil and a felt disc in the middle. That kept dust out of the moving parts.

That radio looks right at home in your dining room!

_________________
The mind is like a parachute - just because you lost yours doesn't mean you can borrow mine.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Thu 22, 2007 5:42 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 13246
Location: Tennessee,USA
Hi Christina,
I receoved an email from the fellow who is helping with your radio.

I could not find a dial stringing pattern for the radio, and even with the pictures I can't say for sure how the string is routed, It shows 2 'worm' gears, and I am not sure if this is connected to the tuning knob shaft.

There are also 2 'idler' pulleys that can be seen underneath the chassis.

I would suspect that the string is wrapped around the tuning cap pulley, then thru the idler, and then the worm gear assembly?

Some of you guys might be able to figure this one out. Or maybe someone has a similar tuning mechanism

I know if it were in front of me, I'd be able to see what turns what way, and so forth.
Even with my "mind's eye" I am having a time figuring this one out. The repair guy is at the point of being ready to string it up.
Take care,
Gary.
Image
Image
Image
Image


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Thu 22, 2007 7:29 am 
These dials are strung much the same as a Radiola 17 or 18 and a lot of the late-20's sets..

If you'll have the repair guy send me his phone no. I'll call him and try to "talk him through" the procedure.

Dale
HertzsogoodATaolDOTcom


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Thu 22, 2007 8:14 pm 
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Location: Tennessee,USA
Thanks Dale,
I will forward your address to him, so you can hook up. (I don't have his phone number). Hopefully he can see how it is strung,
Thanks!
Gary.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Wed 28, 2007 6:48 pm 
I glued in a new grill cloth (the original was glued). I used Howard's Restore-A-Finish in walnut, using 4-O steel wool where the old finish was actually flaking, which seemed to "feed" the wood and deposit some color into scratches so they don't show as much. It worked especially well on the front legs.

It looks like there is some white paint on the side. I couldn't get it off with my fingernail. The Howard's didn't dissolve it either. I don't want to start putting lacquer or paint thinner to remove it as it's just a few flecks and removing it might create a worse problem.

<a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a367/Jenessey/HPIM1172.jpg" border="0" alt="Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket"></a>

This was the worst area of the wood:

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a367/ ... IM1177.jpg

Top of Cabinet:

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a367/ ... IM1183.jpg

Escutcheon: Just leave it alone or brighten it in some way?

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a367/ ... IM1178.jpg


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mar Wed 28, 2007 6:50 pm 
Here's the photo that doesn't work in the post above:

Image


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