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 Post subject: Old speaker cone treatment?
PostPosted: Jan Tue 01, 2008 9:48 am 
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Joined: Jul Sun 02, 2006 9:15 pm
Posts: 884
Location: Norwalk, CT
Anybody got a favorite preventive maintenance chemical for old speaker cones? An oil maybe?

I may paint the surround on this one with the slow drying RTV - it comes out nice. Has worked well for repairs in past, but this '50s speaker is still very good - just want to keep it tight and give it the longest life.

Denis


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Tue 01, 2008 10:40 am 
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Joined: Apr Sun 08, 2007 6:47 am
Posts: 4381
Location: British Columbia
If the cone is not brittle I leave it alone, if it is a little brittle I paint it with general purpose contact cement. Silicone I would not recommend, it's too thick and doesn't level out like the contact cement, rubber cement would also work.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Tue 01, 2008 3:38 pm 
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Joined: Nov Wed 07, 2007 12:44 am
Posts: 1664
Location: Hawthorne, Ca
If there isn't any damage to the cone, I would recommend not putting anything on it as any treatment will change the resonant frequency of the speaker. If I do anything, I will use a very light film of clear silicone sealer to repair tears in the paper. Harry


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 2:19 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 15750
Location: ID 83301
This topic shows up alot over the years . The answer depends totaly on if you want this done right or you want to follow 30 out of 40 people on a forum .

Silicone glue contains tons of acids eats up stuff . GC cement is just a bottle of contact cement and that stuff eventually dries hard and falls off

Call up any professional speaker rebuilder and ask them if they smear silicone or GC glue on speakers .


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 3:10 am 
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Joined: Jul Sun 02, 2006 9:15 pm
Posts: 884
Location: Norwalk, CT
I have no qualms about painting the surround on a plastic AA5 with silicone. And yes the silicone levels beautifully if you buy the right stuff.

Not on this radio though - it's a nice RCA 9 tube and is turning into a good performer here. So I want not to make a misstep.

The speaker is a little dry, and a little flappy at the edges - it hasp and rasp at me (before clipping starts) when pushed, but I can live with it.

Remember the idea of the question is not repair, but preventive maintanence. I think Ken and Big Harry are probably correct. Recone or leave alone.

But I did think there may be an accepted treatment that is generally used to prevent further drying.


Last edited by ds bk on Jan Wed 02, 2008 3:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 3:13 am 
Silent Key

Joined: Jan Tue 16, 2007 11:48 pm
Posts: 9664
Location: Hueytown, AL
Ken G. I don't have a clue what "professional" speaker reconers use these days but a half century ago we used GC speaker cement (by the gallon) in our speaker reconing business as well as all speaker supplies from Waldom Electronics who furnished the GC cement for the purpose. As of two years age they indicated they still sold speaker reconing supplies and GC sells speaker repair cement, and apparently fairly recently under two labels, One as "speaker repair cement: and the other as "Service Cement" which is labelled on the bottle as "Speaker Repair Adhesive", part #10-1302-0000. GC may market a contact cement but that is not what I use for speakers and doubt that GC recommends it for that purpose if they do. The service cement works well, goes on easy, and I have never had any to dry up and fall off. It does dry firmly but is not brittle. Contact cement is a rubbery product used to attach laminates to plywood and other glue-up jobs of like nature and is not remotely like the speaker cement.

But I must say I agree with you about the silicone product. IMHO, it has its place but speaker repair is not it. To each his own. If you like it and it works, use it :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 4:01 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 10670
Location: Valley City ND USA
For brittle undamaged cones I've tried assorted hand lotions thinned with rubbing alcohol, trying to make the paper more supple.
Results spotty.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 4:18 am 
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Joined: Aug Sun 26, 2007 6:01 am
Posts: 58
Location: Detroit, MI
Reading along here.....and if there is a small punched tear on the cone but it is all still there and when no pressure is on it looks normal......what would you recommend to repair it? Thanks


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 4:18 am 
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Joined: May Tue 30, 2006 7:28 am
Posts: 4489
Location: Southern Ga.
No the best way to do is not use glue or cements for an intact speaker but if its all there and just dry rotted use one half mineral spirits mixed with tung oil.
Just brush it on with a camel hair brush let it dry do it again.

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Rodney


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 7:25 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 11897
Location: Haledon, NJ, usa
Try this WETLOOK speaker treatment. Works great!
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=340-512

_________________
" To be a man, Be a non-conformist, Nothing is as sacred as integrity of your own mind." Emerson


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 2:25 pm 
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Joined: Jul Sun 02, 2006 9:15 pm
Posts: 884
Location: Norwalk, CT
Pbpix wrote:
Try this WETLOOK speaker treatment. Works great!
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=340-512


That's interesting Peter, water soluble - looks like.

Thanks everyone - I have good input on this question.

Denis


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Wed 02, 2008 5:56 pm 
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Joined: Jun Wed 14, 2006 2:36 pm
Posts: 297
Location: Charlotte
Peter,

I just checked out that Wetlook product. Looks promising. Are you saying that it works well for repairs of tears, etc?

Up until recently, I was patching with airplane dope, contact cement, etc. Last week I tried silicone and well, I'm just not happy with it. I don't like the way it looks on the speaker (wasn't able to achieve nice thin coat) and I'm more concerned about the corrosive tendencies of silicone. I'm sure if I had some better silicone, it would have been easier to apply.

Like apparently many of us, I'm on backorder with replacement paper cones from a distributor who shall remain nameless.

I'd like to try this Wetlook on small tears, etc. Would you recommend it for that type of usage? If not, should I go back to GC Bond Adhesive (I just ordered a couple more bottles)?

Thanks, Dan


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Fri 04, 2008 11:49 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
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Location: Haledon, NJ, usa
DANT123
Where do you get your paper cones? And why should it remain namelss...lol
I've gotten them from http://www.electronix.com/catalog/advan ... ords=cones

But they don't have 4" cones and the 6" cones are on permanent backorder. ( update edit: they are .. now available)
The WETLOOK stuff may work to fill a very small tear.. but it is primarily a "treatment" to keep the paper flexible and strong and preserve it.
It is water clean up.
Great stuff.

Regular Elmer's white glue will fix tears nicely.

However, I use "Sobo" a clear flexible fabric cement available in fabric stores and such. I really like it a lot.
http://www.shopvarneys.com/ePOS?this_ca ... design=510

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" To be a man, Be a non-conformist, Nothing is as sacred as integrity of your own mind." Emerson


Last edited by Pbpix on May Sun 09, 2010 3:04 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Sat 05, 2008 1:14 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 3957
Location: Connecticut. USA
This Crosley speaker had many holes and tears due to someone not being careful putting the speaker back in the caninet.
The mounting studs made holes in the cone, I had to glue and put pieces of cone paper from another speaker to patch it.
Image
Note: That white thin cardboard over the voice coil, that I added to protect the voice coil from dirt, it had no cover.
Any how I find this glue to be flexable and good for speaker repair.

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Bill Benson


==============================


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Sat 05, 2008 1:31 am 
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Joined: Jun Wed 14, 2006 2:36 pm
Posts: 297
Location: Charlotte
Peter,

Yeah, it's Electronix as well. I didn't want to mention them by name untill I knew the status of those 6's..you're right..not a sign of them. I just got a shipment of 5's and 8's...no 6's. I'm anxious to try replacing the speaker cone as you recommended in another post, just saving a perimeter around the voice coil.

I've got several smaller radios that could use the 4's, but right now the Admiral that I'm working on will work just fine with the 5.

Any tips on getting that cardboard gasket (protecting the edge of the original cone) out in one (or a few) pieces, and if not, do you just cut a new one?

I'm not sure how much positioning and gluing I'll be doing while the radio is playing...this one is an AC/DC set that I try and stay hands off the hot chassis as much as possible. It'll be more trial and error than anythng else.

Man, those are great prices on those cones..I ordered up about 30 - 40 of them

I'll head off to Michael's tomorrow to look into the Fabric Cement. I've got some GC on the way as well.

Thanks again for the tip. It really sounds promising.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Sat 05, 2008 3:55 am 
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Joined: Oct Sun 22, 2006 3:18 am
Posts: 4
If the speaker is not torn too bad, clear nail polish can work to repair a tear. It will minimize distortion and still strong enough to stop damage from continuing. (Bar bands have used this trick for years to fix speakers.)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Sat 05, 2008 4:37 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
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Location: Haledon, NJ, usa
Dant123
That SOBO fabric stuff is especially good for the center area that mates to the new cone.
Image

I also use Fabri-Tac for the outer ring area as it is tackier and it holds in place well while positioning better.

I try to get that thick outer ring off with a utility knife... but if it breaks I don't care as I just glue the broken sections back anyway. Sometime I don't get it all perfect but most of it is all you need to fill the distance to the mounting area of the cabinet and broken less thick sections will still hold the cone in place with the Fabr-tac cement... while held with clothes pins.

If you are using an isolation transformer ( or if you plug it in so the chassis connection to the AC cord goes into the wide blade side of your wall outlet) you should be able to touch the \chassis while the radio is on to tilt it backwards so the speaker is horizontal while playing. It really helps me position it and know it will work as I can hear everything... else if you wait till dry and it's wrong you have to tear it all apart again.

BTW:
Remember you can make the 5" cones fit a 4" speaker if you cut it in overlapping sections like I show in my pictures " pizza" speaker.
( this one below is actually a 6" cone cut to fit a 5" basket)
Image

_________________
" To be a man, Be a non-conformist, Nothing is as sacred as integrity of your own mind." Emerson


Last edited by Pbpix on Apr Tue 01, 2014 11:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Sat 05, 2008 6:49 am 
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Posts: 11323
Location: Warner Robins, GA
I use Elmers school glue to fix speakers. It works good.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Sat 05, 2008 5:24 pm 
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Joined: Jul Sun 15, 2007 8:24 am
Posts: 120
Location: Barcelona, Spain
The speaker of my Philco 90 was in bad condition. The surround was very bristle and it fell easily into small pieces. The cone was better but had a small crease. I changed the surround. You can find new ones of many sizes in "Simply Speakers". They sell kits to repair speakers at very good prices. (https://plus38.safe-order.net/simplyspe ... eform.html). I would recommend to change the surround rather than treating the old one. As for the cone, Nick's method worked very well for me. I sprayed it with WD-40 and left it dry. Then I applied two layers of nail lacquer. For the creases and a small hole, I glued them, including two minute pieces that had fell off. Then I applied extra lacquer on the back of these weaker zones in order to seal the openings completely. The speaker works very well now and I feel that it is well protected. I would enclose a photograph but I do not know how to do it.

Manuela :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jan Sun 06, 2008 5:56 am 
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Joined: Jun Wed 14, 2006 2:36 pm
Posts: 297
Location: Charlotte
Peter,

At the risk of losing my Man Card for the week I stopped in Joann's (sp?) Fabrics and picked up both adhesives you recommended. The women in there hadn't seen a man in that store in about 3 weeks, so they were all too eager to help me out. I found the Sobo and the Fabri-Tac. Tried them both this evening on that Admiral. Man, I got to say what an improvement! That speaker was becoming one solid patch. Once I cut away the speaker cone from around the vc I could see why. It was so dry rotted that any vibration was just tearing it apart. I replaced the cone with the 5' from Electronics. I used the Sobo around the vc and the Fabri-Tac around the outer ring.

That Fabri-Tac stayed just tacky just long enough for me to jostle the cone around to ensure I wasn't rubbing any edges or anything. A couple quick checks with the radio turned back on for good measure confirmed that.

The original cardboard gasket helped ensure a good seal.

What a difference in sound. That original just sounded harsh, brittle with horribly distorted percussives, the replacement is nice and clean. I knew the original cone was too far gone for basic patches, but now I'm thinking of all those speakers that could use this treatment. I think it's a better looking repair than some of the spider webs of patches I've done in the past, although I would imagine that some of the real purists balk at the idea of swapping out the cones if at all possible. Then again, flip one of my radios over and count the orange drops.

Not a bad repair with a .39 replacement cone and a couple bottles of glue. Thank you again Peter and others that offered up their speaker tips.


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