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 Post subject: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Tue 17, 2018 5:16 pm 
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Location: Haledon, NJ, usa
I've seen a lot of amp builders choose the Russian military PIO caps for audio.
I'm building another new amp requiring .1uf caps... so if these are worth it I'll try 'em.
Can anyone expound on this a bit more if there is indeed any serious respect for these caps or is it just more audio-phoolery?

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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Tue 17, 2018 7:31 pm 
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Location: Wayside, NJ Monmouth
Found this on an AudioFool web site
They form a special magical reaction with the oxygen free cables, the special wooden box the amplifier is in, and various other superstitions only audiophools can see. These things aren't meant for ordinary muggles who have to do electronics by applying physics and math.


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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Tue 17, 2018 8:21 pm 
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Location: Cortez, Colorado
I've have some and I've used a bunch. Not the more expensive K75s but the K42Y-2. They endup costing about as much as a Orangedrop with shipping. This one has K42-Ys and Panasonic polypropylene in the audio stages, and K73 Polythelene Teraphthalate in the power supplies.


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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Tue 17, 2018 10:15 pm 
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Tin Omen wrote:
I've have some and I've used a bunch. Not the more expensive K75s but the K42Y-2. They endup costing about as much as a Orangedrop with shipping. This one has K42-Ys and Panasonic polypropylene in the audio stages, and K73 Polythelene Teraphthalate in the power supplies.

Ok... you are using them... but what can you say about them?... what, if any, detectable differences are there?

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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Tue 17, 2018 10:17 pm 
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Location: near ST Louis Mo 62002
To me pio caps sound fuzzy and roll off the top end

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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Tue 17, 2018 10:29 pm 
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battradio@ wrote:
To me pio caps sound fuzzy and roll off the top end

Thank you... and what sounds better? film caps?... regular yellow colored metal film or polyester or Mylar? or polypropylene?

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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Tue 17, 2018 10:49 pm 
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Location: Cortez, Colorado
Pbpix wrote:
Tin Omen wrote:
I've have some and I've used a bunch. Not the more expensive K75s but the K42Y-2. They endup costing about as much as a Orangedrop with shipping. This one has K42-Ys and Panasonic polypropylene in the audio stages, and K73 Polythelene Teraphthalate in the power supplies.

Ok... you are using them... but what can you say about them?... what, if any, detectable differences are there?


My ears aren't good enough, but they sound fine to me. If I'm going to use a cap in an audio circuit, I would use either a Russian PIO or a polypropylene. And as Ed said, don't need any boutique $10 to $60 caps, a dollar or two max. Some say foil and pp is better than metalized pp.
Panasonic ECW-F
Orangedrops 715p at AES are usually cheaper than at mouser.
There's also Wima, but they are in a box and usually with short leads.


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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Tue 17, 2018 10:56 pm 
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I prefer film and foil polypropalyne caps , tin foil over the aluminum foil , lead crimps on the aluminum foil fail over time . Copper foil cost way to much

https://www.parts-express.com/cat/film- ... PortalID=1


https://www.parts-express.com/cat/film- ... PortalID=1

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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: Apr Wed 18, 2018 2:35 am 
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Location: Cortez, Colorado
Dang that's a good deal Mark. Nice looking too.


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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: May Thu 03, 2018 8:44 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 1630
Location: Silver Spring MD, USA
I rebuilt an old Valco amp and tried different coupling caps in it while I still had it on the bench.

Did a taste test using an Orange Drop (716P), and a K40Y-9 PIO.

To my ears, the Orange Drops are very clean, a bit lean sounding (not as much midrange), and more crispy high end. A little too 'bright' for this particular amp.

The Soviet PIOs might not have the top end of Orange Drops, but they have a much more pronounced midrange. It was perfect for that amp, so that's what I put in it. Sounds really 'thick' to my ears. It's a guitar amp, clearly not the frequency range of a hi-fi.

I do want to build a stereo amp (probably 2A3) and try them there, as well as other types.

I'd say, build a really simple circuit, try different caps and see what you like. A simple circuit will make the tone of the caps easier to discern.

I am interested in the K75 caps too, need to get some.

Oh. I almost forgot. I have a Dynaco PAS I put Sprague Hyrel PIOs on both the phono and the line boards and it sounds good.

-Kevin

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Last edited by HalliFan on May Thu 03, 2018 8:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: May Thu 03, 2018 8:46 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
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Location: Silver Spring MD, USA
Sorry double post. Stupid fingers!

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Crawls Backward When Alarmed: Guitars, amps, vintage radios and more.


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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: May Thu 03, 2018 10:53 pm 
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HalliFan wrote:
I rebuilt an old Valco amp and tried different coupling caps in it while I still had it on the bench.

Did a taste test using an Orange Drop (716P), and a K40Y-9 PIO.

To my ears, the Orange Drops are very clean, a bit lean sounding (not as much midrange), and more crispy high end. A little too 'bright' for this particular amp.

The Soviet PIOs might not have the top end of Orange Drops, but they have a much more pronounced midrange. It was perfect for that amp, so that's what I put in it. Sounds really 'thick' to my ears. It's a guitar amp, clearly not the frequency range of a hi-fi.

I do want to build a stereo amp (probably 2A3) and try them there, as well as other types.

I'd say, build a really simple circuit, try different caps and see what you like. A simple circuit will make the tone of the caps easier to discern.

I am interested in the K75 caps too, need to get some.

Oh. I almost forgot. I have a Dynaco PAS I put Sprague Hyrel PIOs on both the phono and the line boards and it sounds good.

-Kevin

Hi Kevin:
I'm using them in my new SE 12SL7 - 6V6 stereo amp.
http://antiqueradios.com/forums/viewtop ... 2&t=333779

It's a nice clean ( great sounding amp) ... and I mean great... I truly am impressed.

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 Post subject: Re: Why PIO?
PostPosted: May Fri 04, 2018 3:33 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 1630
Location: Silver Spring MD, USA
Pbpix wrote:
Hi Kevin:
I'm using them in my new SE 12SL7 - 6V6 stereo amp.
http://antiqueradios.com/forums/viewtop ... 2&t=333779

It's a nice clean ( great sounding amp) ... and I mean great... I truly am impressed.


That's really nice! I see you scored some of the "special" red K-40Y-9 caps! Da, comrade! :lol: I have a couple; most of mine are silver.

Now you have me thinking of building something similar. The 6V6 is my favorite power tube. I'm sure your amp sounds great. And the 'cabinet' is brilliant.

Now I have to read more of your thread.

-Kevin

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Crawls Backward When Alarmed: Guitars, amps, vintage radios and more.


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