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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 3:06 am 
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Location: N. Vancouver B.C. Canada
For those of us who are retired, how much difference does it make? Not much for me. However it does give us old guys one more thing to complain and argue about.

best regards,
Sandy
PS: This was posted at 6:08 Pacific Standard Time. It would read the same if it had been posted during Daylight Saving Time. :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 3:14 am 
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the only problem with staying on savings time is the darkness that would be in the mornings from October until March.

with busses, schools, and kids along the roads two to three hours before the sun comes up would not be a good thing.

just wait until the kids are standing out for the bus two hours before the sun comes up. just wait until a child gets hit or run over which is a valid concern.

I believe PA did something extra with Savings Time in 1974. after being in the dark until 9:00 twilight in December and surrounding months, PA said no more.

again, I'm going on memory from whence I was 4 years old and can remember going to school "at night".

---

from the net:

Jan 6, 1974 - Daylight Saving Time Started. When local standard time was about to reach Sunday, January 6, 1974, 2:00:00 am clocks were turned forward 1 hour to Sunday, January 6, 1974, 3:00:00 am local daylight time instead. Sunrise and sunset were about 1 hour later on Jan 6, 1974 than the day before. There was more light in the evening.

----

I like Standard Time and detest the Savings Time "spring ahead" time. i despise daylight until nearly 10 PM from may to august. sunset at 7:30 or earlier is fine.

steve

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 4:01 am 
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During the energy crunch Va was also on DST, in fact I have always thought that change applied to entire nation. It was a pain as sun didn't rise till after 8:00 AM.

Here on east coast DST works well in summer months, no way I'd want to stop the time change. It's getting dark at 8:30 and I consider that perfect. Now already dark at 5:15 and that sucks, BUT unfortunately there isn't enough light hours in the day during winter. In Indianapolis where my younger daughter lives, during summer DST it's still light at almost 10:00 PM. I could see IN staying on STD time year round(and until 10-12 years ago they did).

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 4:18 am 
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Dutch Rabbit wrote:
the only problem with staying on savings time is the darkness that would be in the mornings from October until March.

with busses, schools, and kids along the roads two to three hours before the sun comes up would not be a good thing.

just wait until the kids are standing out for the bus two hours before the sun comes up. just wait until a child gets hit or run over which is a valid concern.

I believe PA did something extra with Savings Time in 1974. after being in the dark until 9:00 twilight in December and surrounding months, PA said no more.

again, I'm going on memory from whence I was 4 years old and can remember going to school "at night".

---

from the net:

Jan 6, 1974 - Daylight Saving Time Started. When local standard time was about to reach Sunday, January 6, 1974, 2:00:00 am clocks were turned forward 1 hour to Sunday, January 6, 1974, 3:00:00 am local daylight time instead. Sunrise and sunset were about 1 hour later on Jan 6, 1974 than the day before. There was more light in the evening.

----

I like Standard Time and detest the Savings Time "spring ahead" time. i despise daylight until nearly 10 PM from may to august. sunset at 7:30 or earlier is fine.

steve


Agreed, I'll add I don't like the extra costs on my electric bill caused by having to run my air conditioner harder and longer. On hot days the house doesn't cool down properly until after sundown. I also would be fine with sunset at 7:30 or earlier.

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 4:30 am 
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Time is an artificial, man-made concept. Regardless of the display on a clock, the day/night cycle continues.


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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 4:50 am 
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atwaterkent1 wrote:
Agreed, I'll add I don't like the extra costs on my electric bill caused by having to run my air conditioner harder and longer. On hot days the house doesn't cool down properly until after sundown. I also would be fine with sunset at 7:30 or earlier.

And how is there a difference?

If there is say 14 hours of light, still requires same amount of running time to maintain temperature.

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 5:04 am 
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Location: Ft Worth TX
Quote:
still requires same amount of running time to maintain temperature
Agree. Same amount of heat radiated, no matter what the clock says. I submit the use of the word "savings" is a ruse and obfuscation. In a 24hr, vastly over-illuminated metro world, absolutely nothing is 'saved'.

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 5:26 am 
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35Z5 wrote:
atwaterkent1 wrote:
Agreed, I'll add I don't like the extra costs on my electric bill caused by having to run my air conditioner harder and longer. On hot days the house doesn't cool down properly until after sundown. I also would be fine with sunset at 7:30 or earlier.

And how is there a difference?

If there is say 14 hours of light, still requires same amount of running time to maintain temperature.


Its cooler in the morning, DST moves an hour to evening when its hotter. This is pretty simple stuff, shouldn't be hard to understand....

Arizona observed DST in 1967 under the Uniform Time Act because the state legislature did not enact an exemption statute that year. In March 1968 the DST exemption statute was enacted and the state of Arizona has not observed DST since 1967. This is in large part intended to conserve energy. Phoenix and Tucson are among the hottest U.S. metropolitan areas during the summer, resulting in more power usage from air conditioning units and evaporative coolers in homes and businesses. An extra hour of sunlight while people are active would cause people to run their cooling systems longer, thereby using more energy.[33]

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Last edited by atwaterkent1 on Nov Fri 15, 2019 5:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 5:29 am 
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Alan Voorhees wrote:
Time is an artificial, man-made concept. Regardless of the display on a clock, the day/night cycle continues.


You might want to read this Alan.


https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 123249.htm

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 6:15 am 
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Yes. Sleep at X:XXpm, wake at XX:XXam forces one into an unnatural cycle. Arbitrarily changing the numbers is artificial.


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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 12:20 pm 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 1433
Location: Arlington, VA USA
There has been bill introduced for permanent DST. The Sunshine Protection Act. It has bipartisan support. So hopefully soon we can stop with messing with the clocks.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/senate-bill/670


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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 2:14 pm 
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Joined: Sep Wed 03, 2008 1:24 am
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Location: Boston, MA
I don't find adjusting the clocks a big deal, aside from the 1 or 2 days it takes to adjust.

Without DST, it would get dark here at 7:30 in mid-summer, which is way too early. And getting daylight at 3:45 would be useless to me. Permanent DST would be OK, even it would mean dark mornings in the winter. I can understand why folks in Detroit and Indiana would want it the opposite.

Someone mentioned Arizona. For the record, while AZ does not do DST, the Indian reservations, most of which are on the east and north side of the state, do adjust their clocks. Except for one reservation, which does not.

Time zones, however, are never going away; the country is too big.


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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 2:23 pm 
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...8 time zones in the USSR

imagine doing business between moscow and kamchatka between 9am and 5 pm. lol

steve

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 4:47 pm 
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atwaterkent1 wrote:
35Z5 wrote:
atwaterkent1 wrote:
Agreed, I'll add I don't like the extra costs on my electric bill caused by having to run my air conditioner harder and longer. On hot days the house doesn't cool down properly until after sundown. I also would be fine with sunset at 7:30 or earlier.

And how is there a difference?

If there is say 14 hours of light, still requires same amount of running time to maintain temperature.


Its cooler in the morning, DST moves an hour to evening when its hotter. This is pretty simple stuff, shouldn't be hard to understand....

I fully understand & still don't see your logic. My thermostat has no idea if time is 6:00 AM, noon, 7, 8, 9 or whenever PM. It's set to maintain 74* in summer and 71* in winter. Unless I'm going to be gone for most of day/night, I never touch it.

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 5:03 pm 
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Quote:
My thermostat has no idea if time is 6:00 AM, noon, 7, 8, 9 or whenever PM.

Mine does and I hate it. It is one of those "smart" ones, linked to my phone. I hate it, just wanted a simple old fashion type but when I had new air system installed that's what showed up. It's called a "Nest" and for my simple requirements it is confusing as it tries to figure out on it's own what I want depending on the time of day and if it senses if I am at home. All I want is ON/OFF COOL/WARM based on a single temperature setting.
Well, someday I may change it out for a simple one.
EDIT: It is starting to cool down here in Florida, so soon I will have to figure out how to change it from "Cool" to "Heat".. Almost afraid to touch it as I finally got it to work properly on "cool" :roll:

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Last edited by pauls.ironhorse on Nov Sat 16, 2019 2:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 5:59 pm 
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Joined: Mar Thu 29, 2012 8:51 pm
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Location: upper midwest
Rather than changing clocks, why not get everyone to agree to change their schedules instead? Is that more trouble than changing all the clocks?

I remember one winter in Minnesota in the late 70s they kept DST all year. Standing outside waiting for the school bus, pitch black out. Around here, keeping DST in the winter does not do much for additional daylight for evening activities as it will still be sundown around 5:30pm.


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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 7:58 pm 
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Location: Boston, MA
The reality is that most people in this country work typical full time job hours, starting between 7 and 9 and going to late afternoon or early evening. Schools start at similar time and end earlier. And it's a big country.

In the summer in Arizona, residents want it to be cooler at night when they begin leisure time activities outdoors, so they prefer it to get dark earlier. OTOH, in the North Eastern US, residents want some daylight after work so they can play softball, go for walks etc.

It's just an hour; after a couple of days, no-one notices the change anymore.


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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Fri 15, 2019 10:37 pm 
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palegreenthumb wrote:
I don't like daylight savings time. It screws up my entire collection of sundials.

The sun is supposed to be overhead at noon, not at 1pm.

Exactly. Noon is noon by the location of the sun, not by some arbitrary law (and then not in every state). How is having a shorter morning and longer afternoon beneficial? Farmers work from sunup to sundown, irregardless of what the clock says so it's of no benefit to them. Students? Hardly. DST often puts them at the bus stop in the dark and since they get out at 2:30 the late daylight has no effect. Sorry, never understood the point. :?

Larry

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Sat 16, 2019 12:43 am 
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Lot's of people notice the change around here when its sunny late into the evening. Its even harder on working people as the studies show.

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 Post subject: Re: Daylight savings time forever in IL
PostPosted: Nov Sat 16, 2019 2:16 am 
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Joined: Jun Mon 24, 2013 3:00 pm
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Location: Champaign IL 61822
pauls.ironhorse wrote:
Quote:
My thermostat has no idea if time is 6:00 AM, noon, 7, 8, 9 or whenever PM.

Mine does and I hate it. It is one of those "smart" ones, linked to my phone. I hate it, just wanted a simple old fashion type but when I had new air system installed that's what showed up. It's called a "Nest" and for my simple requirements it is confusing as it tries to figure out on it's own what I want depending on the time of day and if it senses if I am at home. All I want is on/off cool/warm based on a single temperature setting.
Well, someday I may change it out for a simple one.
EDIT: It is starting to cool down here in Florida, so soon I will have to figure out how to change it from "cool" to "heat".. Almost afraid to touch it as I finally got it to work properly on "cool" :roll:


Its perfectly possible to turn that ALL off on your Nest. I have. It took a while as new
misfeatures appeared. You have to search very hard online for all of the manuals ...
including the installer's one. I had to get two manuals and study them. The sensor
seems more accurate than the old "mercury switch on a bimetal strip".

They really really don't want you to do this ... they hide the controls in multiply nested (a pun) menus.

Also, my office has a fancy Samsung heat pump system, separate control and air unit for each room, but running off the same outdoors compressor system. Same problem and solution. Oh yes,
the control itself is labeled in Egyptian hieroglyphics, you need a manual to translate.


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