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 Post subject: Re: Powering up a set with a variac - The Craftsmen RC 200 r
PostPosted: Jan Tue 08, 2019 5:43 am 
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Ok, so I thought I was done recapping the vertical section, but things aren't making sense to me. C92 is a .01 according to the schematic, but I think it is suppose to be a .1 uf. The cap I took out matches C93, which is a .1 on the schematic. When I check them, they are both pretty close to the .1uf value. So, I don't know what I have. There are a lot of differences between the schematic I have and what I am seeing in this section of this set. So, I am putting back in the same values I am taking out, even if it disagrees with the schematic. Any ideas?
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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Tue 08, 2019 6:01 am 
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Both of the old striped caps you have shown in the picture above are .1 @ 400 volts.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Tue 08, 2019 6:11 am 
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For my set the schematic for the RC 201 matched what was in the set much better than the schematic for the RC 200.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Tue 08, 2019 6:15 am 
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Dennis, I read Toms post a little more carefully, and I think I have the same modification or change that he had in his set in his 2009 thread. Mine also has the 6BL7 tube, a different osc transformer and output transformer. Any chance either of you might have documentation on this change?

Edit:
I think we posted at the same time Tom. I will have a look and see if I have the Sam's for the 201.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Tue 08, 2019 6:20 am 
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Madmurdok wrote:
I think we posted at the same time Tom. I will have a look and see if I have the Sam's for the 201.

It is set 151 folder 10.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Thu 31, 2019 12:40 am 
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Ok, I have done some recapping. I have the Sam's on the RC201. I went after all the black beauties (at least the ones that had substantial voltage). I corrected the cap on the vertical section and got full sweep.
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I have recapped the horizontal and damper section with no change, also the video and some of the AGC. No change.
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I replaced the separate 20mf at 400v (C3 on the 201) and c80/r98 which comes of the horiz phase det cathode. Ok, NOW I have a change. I was a little confused on the value of C80 (which is only listed on the 201), the schematic calls for a .01mfd, but the tester checked it at about .1mfd. This is the cap right in the middle with a resistor soldered right across it. So, being small, I was betting on it being .01. I jumped it with a .1 with no change.

Now, the change I have is this:
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The B+ came up quite a bit, but width shrunk. HV came up some to about 15kv. I have reduced width and what appears to be a neck shadow. The good is that the pic is brighter and I can see the interlace, whereas before, I could not see that. It was fuzzy. Now, when I got full vertical sweep before (the last 2 caps), the pic was very dim. The ION trap magnet was shoved up against the yoke. I pulled it back and rotated it for brightest picture. Now, I can move it around and can see the neck shadow move but cant eliminate it. I set it for brightest pic. I dont know if raising the B+ has done this or if I messed something up. I may tack the old parts in one by one and see if things change back. Yes, still more caps to replace. Note* the yoke is forward as far as it will go. I havent disturbed it. I can push the ION trap towards the yoke and it almost eliminated the neck shadow, but the pic was very dim. I could see where the trap was by the dust marks on the neck of the tube. That is where I have it now.

EDIT: I put the old parts back in to test, and it's still the same. So, I am not sure what has happened.

THIS is one reason I like to test after a few component replacements so I can backtrack if need be.

One other problem I really need help on is a series of caps in front of the vertical out transformer. Neither schematic or layout shows all of these. One of these - the small one right above the pink .47mfd cap has 300v on one side and is covered with oil. In tracing it, it connects directly to one side of the vertical output transformer (white wire) which goes to the yoke connection. C94 as shown goes to the orange wire which goes to (what appears) the horizontal winding of the yoke. So, I need a little help here. Can you tell from the pic what the value of that cap is? I suspect it is really C94 from the voltage that is on it, but the diagram says otherwise.
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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Thu 31, 2019 1:28 am 
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Ok, so I may have changed something on the focus magnet. I havent solved it yet, but it is in better focus lol. Im not quite sure how to address this one. I broke the nut loose on that crank, but that is it. I'm betting this changed something. Now, how do I adjust this? I have never encountered one of these. Any help appreciated.
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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Thu 31, 2019 2:59 am 
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I found this chart for Sprague bumblebee caps. http://pickguardian.com/wp-content/uplo ... -Chart.pdf

Using that chart, the cap immediately above the pink .47 uf cap looks to be a .01 uf 20% 800 volt cap if the colors are brown black orange black gray.
The next one up would be .022 uf 10% 400 volt if the colors are red red orange white yellow.
The one above that would be .1 uf 10% 400 volt if the colors are brown black yellow white yellow.

I can't help too much on the focus magnet. I put an electrostatic focus CRT in mine so the focus magnet has been removed. I will look around and see if I can find it, but don't hold your breath.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Thu 31, 2019 4:13 am 
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Ok, I figured out what happened. I hit the centering rings when I moved that crank looking thing. I studied it and got it back to where it was. Im still not sure of exactly how to adjust. Nothing in the Sam's. On the color codes, I havent had much experiance or practice on caps, so I really appreciate the help. If I can get that one changed, then that will have all the black beauties with voltage on them replaced. It seems the service info on this is off somewhat.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Thu 31, 2019 4:18 am 
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You do have to have the ion trap adjusted for the maximum brightness.

Increased high voltage will make the picture smaller as the electrons will be moving faster and will not deflect as easily. But you will also get a brighter and better focused picture.

There are generally two adjustments commonly made with a focus magnet. One of course is the focus. The other is the centering of the picture. I think that the larger diameter screw adjusts the focus. And that crank adjusts the centering. To do that it would have to move something side to side and up and down. And that last picture of the screen looks like you have a problem with the centering. I think that the neck shadow will disappear when the centering is fixed.

Edit: I see that we posted at about the same time.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Thu 31, 2019 10:41 pm 
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Those red Sangamo capacitors are just as bad as the "Black Beauties". I would replace all of them.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Jan Thu 31, 2019 11:25 pm 
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Madmurdok wrote:
I havent had much experiance or practice on caps
This article has information about identifying and replacing caps in old radios and TVs:

https://antiqueradio.org/recap.htm

Regards,

Phil Nelson
Phil's Old Radios
https://antiqueradio.org/index.html


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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Feb Thu 07, 2019 3:49 am 
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Thanks guys. I think the voltage band is blue, according to my wife and daughter. The 2nd and 4th band looks dark gray according to them (which may be black??). 1st is brown and 3rd is orange. I will repost a pic of that cap to see if you can verify. I dont find this cap or about any other or these on the schematic, so this is kind of a mystery section to me. I really need to verify so I can replace with the correct value. It wont even check on the cap checker so I cant go by that either.

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The .47 was split open, so that was where the oil was coming from. I powered up and injected a video signal into the 1st video amp. After adjusting the vertical and horizontal hold, this is what I got:
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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Feb Thu 07, 2019 4:30 am 
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Based upon the blue band, and the dark bands are black (obviously you can't put a black stripe on a black background), the bottom cap in the photo just above is a .01 @ 600 volts.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Feb Thu 07, 2019 4:33 am 
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Madmurdok wrote:
Thanks guys. I think the voltage band is blue, according to my wife and daughter. The 2nd and 4th band looks dark gray according to them (which may be black??). 1st is brown and 3rd is orange. I will repost a pic of that cap to see if you can verify. I dont find this cap or about any other or these on the schematic, so this is kind of a mystery section to me. I really need to verify so I can replace with the correct value. It wont even check on the cap checker so I cant go by that either.

If that band is blue then it is a 600 volt cap. A much more standard voltage. Common voltages were 600 volts, 400 volts and sometimes 200 volts. As I remember it, they jumped up to 1000 volts if 600 volts was not high enough. I think they used dark gray for black so that you could see it against the black plastic.

Edit: Posting at the same time as Mr. Detrola

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Feb Sat 09, 2019 8:26 pm 
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I recapped that "mystery" section with very little change. Having all the caps replaced with high voltage I turned my attention to finding the problem between the antenna and video amp. I injected an audio signal at the volume control and the sound is loud and clear. I seem to have a "mystery" tuner as well. The 200 shows 3 tubes, and the 201 2 tubes. Neither quite right. Mine has 2 tubes, and only 1 match the schematic of the 201. I have a 6BQ7 instead of a 6CB6 (which tested ok), and a 6J6, which did NOT test ok. That explained the no pic no sound from the antenna. I had a 5J6, so I plugged it in for a test until I can get the right tube. The pic and sound came right in once I found the right channel. I do have sync issues with both the H and V. I also had problems with the injected video signal. I tested the sync sep and amp tubes. I have a 6BF7 (which looks just like a 6AV6) instead of a 6C4 and the correct 12AU7. It tested a little low on one side so I subbed it with a strong tube with no change. This section has been recapped, but I do still have some low voltage caps yet to go as well as power supply cans. B+ is still a little low. So, I have some caps on order.

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Nice big crack in this one.
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The contrast and sync isnt quite as good off the tuner as from video injection at the grid of the 1st video amp. Yeah, you can see my poor 5J6 glowing down there. Dont worry, it wont have to endure the abuse after this test. :wink:
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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Feb Sat 09, 2019 10:04 pm 
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Madmurdok wrote:
I do have sync issues with both the H and V. I also had problems with the injected video signal. I tested the sync sep and amp tubes. I have a 6BF7 (which looks just like a 6AV6) instead of a 6C4 and the correct 12AU7. It tested a little low on one side so I subbed it with a strong tube with no change. This section has been recapped,

Do you mean a 6BF6? The characteristics of the triode part of the 6BF6 are very similar to the 6C4, but the pin outs are different. Does the tube chart agree with the tubes as found in the set? The sync sep circuit can be touchy about having the resistors be exactly the right values. So check the resistors.

The signal level coming out of the IF strip (and therefore the contrast) is controlled by the AGC circuit. According the the schematic, the AGC on this set is not adjustable. So check the resistors around the AGC tube.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Feb Tue 12, 2019 4:20 pm 
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It a 6BF6, my bad. I have started the resto on the power supply. I'll get that done and see how things are. It does look like there has been some wiring changes around the 6BF6. Not much on the tube diagram matches what's actually there. I'll take a pretty close look at the sync and AGC once I get the PS recap finished. I have to be careful on these replacements since this is an area that isn't very clear in the service info. Some of those resistors are kinda hard to see the colors good, and when they don't match the schematic, makes things even more interesting.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Feb Tue 12, 2019 10:27 pm 
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On my set the tube diagram on the back of the chassis matched what was in the set, although it had been modified to do so.
Attachment:
tubechart.jpg
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Does the wiring at the 6BF6 look like it was wired that way at the factory or does it look like someone changed it around later? If it looks like factory wiring then the 6BF6 will likely work OK.

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 Post subject: Re: The Craftsmen RC 200 resto
PostPosted: Feb Sat 16, 2019 4:01 am 
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I found a production change bulletin for this set in Sams set 172 folder 1. It does not help with your mystery vertical circuit, but here it is anyway.
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