Forums :: Resources :: Features :: Photo Gallery :: Vintage Radio Shows :: Archives
Support This Site: Contributors :: Advertise


It is currently Dec Thu 12, 2019 6:01 pm


All times are UTC [ DST ]





Post New Topic Post Reply  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Aug Sat 31, 2019 8:01 pm 
Member

Joined: Nov Tue 03, 2015 9:43 pm
Posts: 95
Location: Illinois, 60565
Greetings and a Thank You to "1st Detroit Tiger game on TV Newspaper":

Do any of the Division 57 data holding members recognize this 1949-50 Silvertone television Model?

Attachment:
The Detroit Times for April 18 1950 MODIFIED.JPG
The Detroit Times for April 18 1950 MODIFIED.JPG [ 269.38 KiB | Viewed 860 times ]


I added the two arrows to show what I believe are the outer edges of a cover plate. The Colonial (101.XYZ) manufactured Silvertone televisions using the 12LP4 CRT with either 3 or 4 control knobs between the volume (left) and tuning (right) and no cover. The Stewart Warner (100.XYZ) manufactured 12LP4 CRT televisions had four controls.

Air-King (110.), Tele-Tone (478.), Warwick (528.), and Hallicrafters (549.), all manufactured Silvertone TVs, but I believe, never offered a 12LP4 CRT in their models.

I suspect that the Silvertone television "Consolette" in the ad could be a Raytheon-Belmont (???) manufactured chassis that was designed to fit in the Silvertone model 9127 cabinet. All good except there is/was no Source Code for Raytheon-Belmont televisions.

Any ideas?

I don't own this television. I was only surprised by the lack of center controls, and wondered who manufactured a TV chassis without a lot of controls in 1949-50. I do understand the print / scan quality is poor and that the original ad could have been air brushed to show no controls. The "Consolette" could have had either 3 or 4 controls and the ad printer simply didn't know which TV Sears wanted displayed at the time.

Thank you.

John


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Sep Mon 02, 2019 9:04 pm 
New Member

Joined: Jan Mon 29, 2018 4:45 pm
Posts: 18
Location: Woodstock, Va
Just a thought. Could Motorola have manufactured the chassis, or the complete set, for Sears? The pictured set somewhat resembles a Motorola 12VK11, which used a TS-23 chassis, and 12LP4 CRT.

Pat


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Sep Tue 03, 2019 3:15 am 
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 9348
Location: Beaver Falls, PA. USA
To my knowledge, Motorola never supplied anything to Sears.

_________________
Tim KA3JRT


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Sep Tue 03, 2019 3:31 am 
Moderator

Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 28028
Location: Detroit, MI USA
Agree that Sears doesn't appear to have ever contracted any TV production from Motorola.

I'm nearly certain it was one of the smaller independents. Sears was well known for doing local specials, sets that were only sold in one market for a promotional event, or only in a certain region. This was common around the holidays and they could have done it at the start of baseball season in a few cities.

_________________
Dennis

Experience is what you gain when the results aren't what you were expecting.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Sep Tue 03, 2019 12:33 pm 
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 9348
Location: Beaver Falls, PA. USA
One possibility is Telequip; they made the 8130 seven-inch set. They were in Chicago, and could have bought cabinets from the same supplier that Motorola used. Without a model and chassis number, we're just guessing.

_________________
Tim KA3JRT


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Sep Tue 03, 2019 2:12 pm 
Member

Joined: Nov Tue 03, 2015 9:43 pm
Posts: 95
Location: Illinois, 60565
Good morning and Thank you Pat, Tim KA3JRT and Dennis:

Over the weekend I believe that the Silvertone television shown in the 1950 newspaper ad does NOT have a center control panel between the two control knobs. Later today, I'll head over to the library to see if I can find a clearer scan of that model television to confirm my 'no panel' suspicion.

I think the Silvertone model is a "132.WXYZ" chassis made by Noblitt-Sparks Industries or "Arvin". Arvin made a series of 12.5" CRT chassis using the TE289 chassis series. They were TE289, TE289-2 and TE289-3. The Arvin TV Models all seem to be numbered as a 212X(2 Letters).

References are Sams 120-3 and Rider's Volumes 6, 7 & 8.

I just want to see if I can find a Silvertone model number along with a Sears chassis number to verify.

If the Silvertone shown is an Arvin chassis then there was no center control panel. This was advanced television thinking in 1949-50 era and might have either drawn or scared away the Sears customers.

Thank you.

John


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Sep Tue 03, 2019 3:47 pm 
Moderator

Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 28028
Location: Detroit, MI USA
Arvin is a really good possibility and Sears did contract with Arvin to build some of their consumer electronics over a period of several decades. They were probably right behind Warwick as one of the main sources Sears relied on.

Likely that Motorola, Arvin, Wells-Gardner, Belmont and many other manufacturers in the midwest sourced TV cabinets from several of the big furniture companies in Grand Rapids, MI during those years, and there was also Caswell-Runyan in Huntington, IN making cabinets although it's unclear how much of their production was TV cabinets.

_________________
Dennis

Experience is what you gain when the results aren't what you were expecting.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Oct Wed 16, 2019 9:28 pm 
Member

Joined: Nov Tue 03, 2015 9:43 pm
Posts: 95
Location: Illinois, 60565
Greetings:

I think that I found the Silvertone Model Number.

Attachment:
22Nov1950 Elyria Chronicle Telegram Pg_3 Silvertone Model 140.jpg
22Nov1950 Elyria Chronicle Telegram Pg_3 Silvertone Model 140.jpg [ 282.59 KiB | Viewed 393 times ]


It appears to be the Model 140 that uses the Air King 110.700 Chassis. No Sams is listed but Rider's has the 110.700 in Volume 10 - 1 for Sears - Silvertone.

Two things that made the search difficult.

(1) Silvertone Model 141 uses the exact cabinet as the 140. The 141 has a Noblitt-Sparks (Arvin) 132.889 chassis. The outer chassis dimensions appear to be the same as the Air King chassis. (Sams 149 - 12 and Rider 15 - 8 for Silvertone) and (Sams 120 - 3 for Arvin chassis TE289-X)

(2) Using the library data source for Newspapers dot Com I was lucky that the Elyria (Ohio) Chronicle Telegram was the only newspaper in the entire 1948 to 1951 USA that showed the Sears / Silvertone TV Model numbers.

The following is all a guess on my part. I suspect that the reason was that Sears wanted to mix and match the chassis / price / delivery by using one style / common cabinet. For example the 12.5" CRT in the console 141 or consolette 140 cabinet are the identical cabinets. Advertised Model numbers would cause Sears customers to ask what is the difference between a 140 and a 141. No salesperson needs that.

I also suspect from seeing many Silvertone Models in the early TV years there was a Model number logic in the beginning. 8XXX being the 1948 models, 9XXX the 1949 models and (0)1XX the 1950 models. Beyond 1950 the model numbering becomes unpredictable. Models as 162-16 or 1117 or 2XXX seem to just pop up, but the number of suppliers seem to be reduced after 1950.

As a note, I have used the library's access to Newspapers dot Com for a few years, but beginning last Jan Newspapers dot Com dropped all the big city newspaper archives. Newspapers dot Com seems to reduce the number of newspapers I can search by 2-3 every couple of months.

Just my 2-cents.

John


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Does Anyone know the Model of this Silvertone TV
PostPosted: Oct Thu 17, 2019 1:42 am 
Moderator

Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
Posts: 28028
Location: Detroit, MI USA
Having worked for Sears for many years and discussed advertising and promotional merchandise with higher level managers, I conclude that over the years that similarity in appearance was done for a reason, and it wasn't unheard of to have two vendors making items that looked basically the same. This goes back well before WW2.

If you are Sears and place an order for enough of any given item, you get to dictate exactly how they will be built, and to what specifications and performance levels, and what price level they will sell for, and even how much you are willing to pay for each one. They were still doing that with Whirlpool-built appliances very recently, so customers could not directly compare the specs of Kenmore branded appliances to Whirlpool units that looked identical, but weren't.

Supposedly Walmart copied that business practice and demanded that suppliers build items exclusively for them and set their cost for each item as well at the time of ordering, with no opportunity for the supplier to negotiate. Either they wanted to sell products to Walmart or they didn't. If it worked for Sears, then any major retailer can get away with the same demands.

There's a really popular pre-WW2 Silvertone console radio which was built by two different vendors, the cabinets looked identical from the outside, control positions on the front panel were not in the same left to right relationship to each other, and the chassis and tube lineups and even speaker size were not the same. The examples go on and on and on.

Those look alike TV's were probably never marketed in the same region or the same cities. One might have been a retail only item in one region or city, the other could have been catalog order only in a different region. That stops confusion at the customer level since unless they traveled a lot, they wouldn't ever be exposed to the advertising for the other model. And that's also why somewhere in the catalog pages it always says they reserve the right to change specifications whenever necessary.

_________________
Dennis

Experience is what you gain when the results aren't what you were expecting.


Top
 Profile  
 
Post New Topic Post Reply  [ 9 posts ]  Moderators: 7jp4-guy, Mr. Detrola

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests



Search for:
Jump to:  




























Privacy Policy :: Powered by phpBB