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 Post subject: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 4:18 am 
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Location: Lady Lake, Fl 32159
Folks I am ready to send this thing to the glue factory.
I have been trying to revive a philco 46-1201 on and off for several weeks. I am unable to identify the code as the previous owner scratched off the stamp on the back of the chassis and apparently went insane when he tried to repair it.
After much floundering I decided to convert it to a code 121; basically gut it completely and build from scratch ( Just to say I did it).
I got done with it tonight and applied power gently and slowly. First thing I noticed was that the pilot lamp and the 50Y6 started glowing like the friggin sun at half voltage which prompted me to shut it down and walk away.
I replaced every cap, resistor and nearly every wire in this thing.
Any ideas folks?


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 6:54 am 
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Happens to the best of us. Go over the wiring against a disposable paper copy of the schematic, one lead at a time, crossing them off as you go.

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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 9:05 am 
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Sounds like a short in the heater circuit. Check for miswiring, solder blobs, burned insulation, stuff like that. I assume that the other tubes aren't lit.

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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 11:45 am 
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I’ll check the wiring guys. Believe it or not, the other tubes were starting to light up but I don’t want to risk a burnout so I shut it down.
Today I will go through every inch.


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 12:10 pm 
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Here’s a look at the hot mess if anyone is interested. I think this is the beginning of a love/hate relationship.
Damn you Bing Crosby; Damn you!


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 4:16 pm 
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Don't feel too bad. I have the same chassis on my bench, different radio,and it has taken me many hours to get it to this stage, where it actually plays.
Don't blame Bing Crosby. In real life, he used a real phonograph with a record changer, no doubt.

This is the voltage doubler power supply circuit. Capacitors C101 and C102 have the correct polarity?
My R100 resistor was faulty. Have you checked yours? It looks like you have a Candohm there.
I had a faulty 1 meg bias resistor on the power tube, but I see you have all new resistors.

A dim bulb tester would be a good idea. Save the pilot light, unscrew it for now.

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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 5:44 pm 
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West coast John I’m embarrassed to say that I have not yet built a dim bulb tester. I am going straight to Home Depot right now and getting the materials to build one.


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 6:28 pm 
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You can splice a bulb holder into one side for a cheap 2-prong extension cord.

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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 8:37 pm 
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There's service information here: http://Audiophile.com/Philco.html but it doesn't give the code number. Is this what you are using? If not, please post a link to what you do have.

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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 10:02 pm 
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One dim bulb tester ready to rock.

Jim the web link you posted is going to a different site (trying to sell me a VPN service).

I’ll be tracing wires tonight starting at the pilot light and working down the line.
I’ll keep you posted folks.


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 11:04 pm 
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West coast John I checked out the c101 and c102 and they are the correct polarity. I also check r100 which also shows fine. I plugged the unit into the dim bulb tester and to my surprise the bulb didn’t glow like I thought it would. The pilot lamp stayed at a constant brightness but the 50y6 seemed to be awe fully bright. I suspect it is the bad penny as none of the other tubes are lighting up. Pic attached.
I ran the tubes through the tester and sure enough the 50y6 failed along with the 35L6.
Any pointers guys?


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sat 12, 2021 11:38 pm 
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The low voltage Loktals don't show a bright glow as you probably know. Check that the series string is continuous thru all 5 tubes, not shorted.
Sounds like you've almost got it. The dim bulb doesn't lie, looks great.
Now since the rectifier tests bad, no harm in trying it and the other one in the radio, but I'm not there with one hand on the kill switch. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sun 13, 2021 12:30 am 
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Hey I can't seem to find a 35L6 loctal tube anywhere. If I were to change the socket to an octal, would a 35L6 octal have the same pin arrangement?


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sun 13, 2021 2:52 am 
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I think you’re going to get into trouble trying to convert this set into a Run 121. The Philco service information identifies the different runs according to components used. This unit is not a Run 121 — that one used a 4x6 inch speaker rather than 5 inch round, and used a Loktal output tube rather than a 35L6 which is octal.

The most important change is this: although most runs of the 46-1201 used a voltage-doubler circuit, there was one run that did not. That could very well be the source of your problem.

My suggestion is to identify which run this is and restore accordingly.

-David


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sun 13, 2021 3:14 am 
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https://philcoradio.com/library/downloa ... 6-1947.pdf
Read service notes on pgs 167 and on...

Terry


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sun 13, 2021 3:35 am 
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Sams Photofact Set-29 Folder-21 Philco 46-1201 (revised).
https://philcoradio.com/phorum/attachment.php?aid=2929

The original publication was Photofact Set-4 Folder-35
I don't have it!

Production changes from April 1, through August 31, 1946
attached below.


Greg.


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sun 13, 2021 4:27 am 
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[quote="westcoastjohn"]Don't blame Bing Crosby. In real life, he used a real phonograph with a record changer, no doubt.

Actually he had a 1201 in his dressing room at Paramount Pictures in the autumn of 1946 when he was filming The Emperor Waltz....

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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sun 13, 2021 1:14 pm 
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egg wrote:
The original publication was Photofact Set-4 Folder-35
I don't have it!



Here's Sams Set 4 / Folder 35


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sun 13, 2021 1:54 pm 
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dberman51 You are correct. I actually have this modeled after a code 127 which as mentioned in the production changes is similar to a 121. I had suspected that the tube marked 35L6 (marked by previous owner) was not correct as physically it is a loctal tube (realizing this after searching to no avail for a 35L6 loctal). I have changed the tube to a known 50A5 according to the code 127 production changes and have verified attached components per the notes for 127.

I am presently waiting for delivery of a 50Y6 tube as it failed a grid test ( blown out after a foolish experiment on my part - Don't ask).
The round permanent magnet speaker is also one of the code 127 production changes.

Radioroslyn, thanks for the info! I already had this, thank the lord. All notes on changes are checked and verified.

egg; thanks for the photofact. I appreciate it.

Great pic of Bing Greg. I think it's odd that there appears to be what looks like a record to his right. Another phonograph player perhaps?

Once the new 50Y6 comes in, I'll let you all know how it goes. Until then I will be re-chacking every note, every wire, every resistor and every solder joint. If it weren't for the fact that Philco makes nice sounding untis, I would have never taken on this project. My 46-1203 was a piece of cake compared to this one.


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 Post subject: Re: Losing my mind with this Philco
PostPosted: Jun Sun 13, 2021 3:30 pm 
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Right, thanks for the pic.
Why two phonos? One was a gift from Philco, and the other one works good. :D

Just kidding. The Philco engineers did some amazing work on these models, and that one in the pic is factory fresh, drool.

The voltage doubler and the 4X6 field coil speaker in the early models sets them apart from the typical AA5. Also the dual control, right for radio, left for phono, is an engineering marvel.


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