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 Post subject: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:51 am 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
Posts: 32
Hello,

I’m very new to jukeboxes but I just picked up a 3W1 D Seeburg Wallbox to go along with my Seeburg 100R.

I put the 3 prong cord into J1, turned on my jukebox (with freeplay adaptor) and no lights or power are on the wallbox.

I flipped this little contact switch I saw mentioned in a YouTube video that should have activated the lights to no avail.

I also foolishly manually moved the stepper in the wallbox and now the number/letter keys don’t depress.

Any suggestions as to why I have no power?

Thank you for your time…


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File comment: 3 Wire Connection
3 Wire Connection.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Mon 11, 2019 4:57 am 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
Posts: 32
Doing some online research, I realized a fuse was missing.
Turns out it's fuse F3, the 3 amp Fustat.


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Mon 11, 2019 7:15 am 
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Joined: Jan Thu 01, 1970 1:00 am
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Location: Redlands CA
That fuse powers the Wallbox.
Once you get the power on, even if the Juke has a freeplay adapter you still need to drop a Quarter in the Wallbox to activate it.


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Wed 13, 2019 5:13 am 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
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Thank you for the reply Eric.
I appreciate the information.


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Sat 16, 2019 6:41 am 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
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Well, I installed the 3 amp fustat fuse, dropped a quarter into the slot and nothing…no power.
I checked those 3 fuses near the 3 amp fustat in my jukebox and they were all good.

I ordered a manual and hopefully I can find something that will resolve this problem.

Has anyone had this issue with not getting power to the wallbox?
Any ideas or help is appreciated.

Thank you…


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Sun 17, 2019 11:12 am 
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Location: Redlands CA
You can download the manual online here: http://www.kjq.us.com/images/3w1.pdf

It's a pretty straightforward circuit, the 25 volts AC come directly off the transformer, through fuse and to the wallbox.
Two wires are for power, one is for the pulse back to the receiver.

I would check for 25 volts AC at the socket for the wall box, if you don't have that then there's a problem with the receiver in the Jukebox, if you have 25 volts all the way back to the wall box then it should power up, you should at least have lights, assuming the bulbs are good.


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Sun 17, 2019 11:15 am 
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Location: Redlands CA
One other thing, make sure the blue wire is connected to the sideways terminal on the plug, that's the pulse wire, the other two are the power wires.


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3w1.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Sun 17, 2019 1:22 pm 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
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Eric, Thank you for your help.

The plug can only go in one way so I’m assuming if have it in the correct way.

With regard to the terminals, this picture is the way I received the wallbox.
You’re saying the blue should be on the outside or am I confusing the two?

I have the orange wire on the outside on the wallbox.

Again, thank you…


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File comment: Wallbox Terminal
Wallbox Terminal.jpg
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J1 plus 3 Amp Plug.jpg
J1 plus 3 Amp Plug.jpg [ 502.95 KiB | Viewed 765 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Sun 17, 2019 5:23 pm 
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Joined: Jun Sun 15, 2014 11:04 pm
Posts: 1105
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
Disconnect all three wires at the wallbox. With the other end still plugged in and the machine powered on, check each pair of wires to confirm if the voltage is present at the wallbox end. If it is, reconnect according to the diagram above, except if the colors don't match. If there is no voltage, that would confirm that the problem is in the receiver. Cheers, Russie


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Sun 17, 2019 6:00 pm 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
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Thank you Russie for the suggestion.

Let me just run through the steps I need to do:

1 - Set my multimeter to AC which is the "V" with a squiggly line.
2 - Make a selection , I believe it starts at 20 then goes to 200.
3 - Take the red and black leads and touch each of the plug prongs and see if I have any power coming from the jukebox.

I'll try it later when I get home from work and post the results.

Thank you again for your help.


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Sun 17, 2019 6:06 pm 
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Location: Redlands CA
The wiring in the wall box looks okay, at least by color code, but the plug end is covered up so we don't know if it's wired correctly, if it was wired up and working before it probably is, but you never know.

You should have 25 volts AC on the Green & Orange wires in the wall box, but check first at the socket of the receiver back at the jukebox.

Also check the fuse, it only makes contact through the thin brass ring around the edge of the socket and the spring contact on the fuse so those need to be clean.

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fuse-socket.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Sun 17, 2019 7:29 pm 
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Joined: Jun Sun 15, 2014 11:04 pm
Posts: 1105
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
Going back to: "Well, I installed the 3 amp fustat fuse, dropped a quarter into the slot and nothing…no power.
I checked those 3 fuses near the 3 amp fustat in my jukebox and they were all good."

Before you dropped the quarter, the two lights above the title pages should have been lit. If they are not, and assuming they are good, there could have been no credits registered when the quarter was dropped. Bothe the lights and the motor and other circuits get their power from the 25VAC line. If working properly, after a coin is dropped successfully, and credits are tallied, the small green rectangle on the floor of the page compartment will light up, and stay lit up until all credits are subtracted. I don't know if that will help, but it is important to know what is supposed to happen.

As Eric pointed out, be sure the 25VAC is supplied at the terminal strip. Polarity is not important, proper connections are.

Cheers, Russie


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Mon 18, 2019 2:40 am 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
Posts: 32
Eric and Russie,

So, I took the wires off the wallbox terminal, checked them with the multimeter and of course, no power at all.

I tried putting the red/black test leads in the jukebox J1 receptacle and no power.

The jukebox does work, just no power to the wallbox.

I couldn't take the casing off the J1 plug.

I checked the 3 amp fuse and that is good.
The lights above the title strip are not on at all, before or after dropping a quarter.
I replaced them with #47’s.

Here are the other fuses as best as I could read them:

1A - 3/2 3AG
303275
250V

3A - 303257
3 Amp fuse
Couldn’t read anything else.

5A - 303257
AG 3?


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J1 plug backup.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Mon 18, 2019 4:57 am 
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Posts: 411
Location: Olympia, Washington
Orange is common ground.

Green is 24 volts AC. The 24 volts operates the motor. There is a small 24 volt to 6 volt step down transformer in the wallbox which operates the 6 volt lights circuit.

Blue is the pulse signals to the jukebox from the wallbox. This is a very low level signal.

You might have a break in the cable. Either the orange wire or the green wire. Either one would kill power to the wall box.


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Mon 18, 2019 5:32 am 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
Posts: 32
"You might have a break in the cable. Either the orange wire or the green wire. Either one would kill power to the wall box."

Hey Ken,

A break in the cable is possible, but how would that explain me not getting power from the J1 receptacle?
Do you think the problem is at the jukebox?

Thank you...


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Mon 18, 2019 6:02 am 
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Location: Redlands CA
If you don't have 25 volts at the parallel blades of the wallbox socket on the receiver there are a few things to check.

You will need to remove the hardboard cover from the lower back door so you can access the receiver, it's easy, three nuts at the top and one screw at the bottom and it tilts out and up.

I have a receiver from a B sitting here, you have an R but I'm guessing it's pretty similar.

With the bottom off you can check the terminals on the screw in fuse holder to see if it has continuity, that fuse is for the 25 volt source,
it appears from just looking that the primary side of the 25V transformer is connected to the twist in glass fuse on the other side closest to the edge, if that was blown I don't think the Jukebox would work at all but you can check to see if the wires from the transformer are connected. The fuse being gone to start with makes me wonder if there was a problem before.

The secondary side of the 25V transformer goes to chassis ground on one side, and to the screw in fuse holder on the other, from the fuse it goes to pin 3 of the wallbox socket and pin 2 is grounded. I think you can see this in the picture. If you have 120 volts into the transformer and nothing out then it would likely be a bad transformer.

The red dots are to make it easier to follow, I hope.
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seeburg-25.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Mon 18, 2019 3:28 pm 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
Posts: 32
When I first bought the jukebox, No one realized the missing lock on the back door.
Upon putting it into the SUV, the door dropped about a foot (didn’t hit the ground) and some wires split in two.

I spliced them to have the jukebox working.

I wonder with that drop if something internal came loose?

I’ll try to take the back panel off later tonight.
The jukebox is currently on some wood for air to circulate because of the carpet.
It’s a major pain to slide it around to get full access to the back.

I’ll report and take a picture when I can.

Hope this is the cause of the power problem.


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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Tue 19, 2019 3:40 am 
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Joined: Nov Mon 11, 2019 1:44 am
Posts: 32
I took the back panel off and didn’t notice any loose wires.

I’m pretty new to using a multimeter proficiently, but I put it on the ohms setting and tried.
With the jukebox off, I tested everything I could around the 3 amp socket.
The J1 (top right in picture) didn’t give me anything.

I just crudely added a “Y” for continuity and “X” no continuity on the picture.

Maybe you can see something…

Also, I found some very hard chips on the bottom when I took off the plate.
I just thought I add a picture if anyone knows what this is.

I don’t know if my description or pictures are of any help but I do appreciate the time
all of you are giving to help me with this problem.


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Back Panel Close Up.jpg
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Back Panel Full.jpg
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Hard Chip.png
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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Tue 19, 2019 3:58 am 
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Location: Redlands CA
Okay, you have different receiver than mine, but it's similar.
I've added to your picture to try and figure it out, the red dots are the 25 volt "hot" the green dots are the 25 volt "Ground" to the chassis, it's AC so no polarity, but it's connected to the chassis at that tube socket, and the wallbox plug is connected to the chassis with that thin bare wire to the terminal strip, everything looks okay.

The hard chips could be transformer tar but I don't see any evidence of overheating.
You need to check for 120 volts AC going into the transformer, I've marked those with Yellow dots but I can't really see where they go. trace those back and see where they go, check for AC voltage at those points.

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back.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: Seeburg 3W1 D Wallbox - No Power
PostPosted: Nov Tue 19, 2019 4:20 am 
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Location: Redlands CA
I found a rather poor PDF of the receiver schematic, it does show that that transformers only purpose is to power the wall box, and it gets it's power through fuse F1, that's one of the fuses on top of the chassis, check those carefully before looking anywhere else, use the Ohm Meter on them even if they look good and make sure they are seated right, there' should be some spring tension on the cap as you twist it, people sometimes put in the wrong fuse, one that's too short to make contact.


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